Was poking around PB websites and found this

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Was poking around PB websites and found this

Postby Hanover » Sat Jul 23, 2005 10:19 pm

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Probably inaccurate but imagine the looks from the other players!


:D
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Postby Despoiler » Sun Jul 24, 2005 8:25 am

That is a Palmer Nasty Typhoon. It's accurate.

http://www.palmer-pursuit.com/catalog/semiautos.htm
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Postby RedKayos » Sun Jul 24, 2005 10:08 am

yeah i have a palmer!!!


i have the pgp redone by palmer........and its the most accurate marker i have owned!!!


gf wants me to sell it but.........i dont want to!!!!!



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Postby Phobos » Mon Jul 25, 2005 8:30 am

Those are not too accurate. Double regulated systems did not exist really since most guns were not too fast back then. Most just used the tanks regulator to set the velocity pressure which on C02 caused very spikey jumps. All expensive guns today use a HP / LP tank regulator, Inline Regulator for the paintball velocity, and a Low Pressure Regulator for the bolt action (less kick).

Mosts pumps are not up to todays standards unless you have the perfect paint for the .688 barrels they used. Paint to barrel match / barrel kits did not exist back in the day. Most barrels were honed exactly to .688. Most paint today works with a good match between .684 - .686 unless it's very big paint (AKA Big Ball / U-Evil - .690 - .692). Also any C02 source makes velocity spikes - bad shots. This weekend I gogged a guy in the face on a string of balls I was throwing at him. 3 hit his goggles a few inches apart. That's good accuracy.

I like the old guns to see how far along paintball has come, but I would never use one. ;)
Last edited by Phobos on Mon Jul 25, 2005 8:59 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Plague Lord » Mon Jul 25, 2005 8:41 am

Palmer's shoot pretty fucking well in comparison to todays wonder barrel systems. Groupings will be better with a complete barrel system. Though I've never seen a palmer fail to consistantly peg the farthest out target on the chrono range.

Considering it's just a very well honed brass tube on a non tourney gun, pretty impressive.
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Postby Despoiler » Mon Jul 25, 2005 9:58 am

I have to agree with Plague. I have seem the Stroker in action and it rivals anything that is out today as far as accuracy. Even the speed was good enough for anything you'd need it for. It will drop strings right where you want them.
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Postby Phobos » Mon Jul 25, 2005 11:40 am

I've shot pretty much everything. You may be able to get accurate shots out of that gun, but no way is it going to be consistent.

Todays guns are just amazing compared to 4 years ago. Since that time I no longer carry barrel squeegies onto the field (I have not had a ball break in my barrel after 3 months of playing every weekend). Eyes pretty much solved the problem with breach breaks, and having a good paint match and quality paint prevents barrel breaks. With lots of porting on the barrel even if you happen to get a barrel break, you can shoot it 90% clear in about 2-3 shots. Guns have gotten less dependent on high pressure fuel sources, and high pressure requirements. With LP tank conversions, you can have your gun work less to achieve the same result. Having your inline regulator converting HP -> LP for your gun to fire is it's job. With new LP tank piston / springs, to nearly match the inline regulator pressure to achieve a higher recharge/ flow rate with less work for the marker.

As far as the barrel goes stainless steel is not as porus as aluminum, therefore it is more accurate, and is easier to shoot clean. People usually take the tradeoff because of the weight factor, and you can annodize aluminum. If you had a great paint / barrel match it would perform as well as any other barrel on the market. I find most of the accuracy does not come from the barrel at all. Actually quite a small fraction. I would say 75% of the accuracy comes from consistent velocity during fast / slow firing.

Even though, I would find it hard pressed to say a pump can throw 'strings', even with two barrels. Considering all tournaments are pretty much PSP mode - 15bps cap, that's an insane ROF. Even when we played pump games at the field a looong time ago it's hard to get a 3" shot when a person is playing really tight, unless your having a really good day with your gun and it's consistent as hell. Even if you take your time to aim, and dont have to worry about the pump action throwing off your aim. The bottom line is the fuel source for them is inconsistent. Sometimes it's right on, sometimes it's all fucked up. Valves sticking, liquid getting in your barrel, velocity spikes, and on hot days it was murder (I've seen spikes up to 347 when it was zeroed at ~300). Why do you think Apocalypse chronos there guns in at 270ish versus 300? I would not say that Compressed Air is the answer to all velocity problems. Even on humid as hell days you will see regs creep +-10FPS, but C02 can flux as much as 40. The difference is once you zero your marker in with Compressed air, it will stay there as long as you did not fuck up a spring or piston.

If you put all of todays modern paintball tech on a pump (Double regulated Compress Air), it would aim great if you had a good paint -> bore match, but I will put money down that an unregulated C02 pump action marker will not get near the accuracy of a new high end marker today.

The problems I see with markers in the shop nowadays all have to do with air flow problems affecting the consistency of the marker under different conditions (Usually because people oil everything, or run oil through the internals of their gun gunking it up, which is a no-no). Tank reg / inline reg is not putting out egnough flow to keep a stream past 8bps, and you get shot drop off. Bad lubrication causing bolt stick is shooting hot for the first shot, then goes down to normal. Or the famous "I've never cleaned my inline regulator ... ever. Which leads to a whole bunch of consistenty problems like spiking, or shot speed up / drop off which makes it impossible to get any aim off the break with. Or the plain old "I just fucked with my dwell settings and shit, now it's all fucked up". :)
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Postby RedKayos » Mon Jul 25, 2005 6:29 pm

well yeah a pump wouldnt be to accurate seeing you have to pump it......but with my palmer its a semi not a pump......and the only thing that varies the accuracy is if i get low on air!!!


i was able to dump a 50 round hoper one ball on top another at 30 ft at a steady firing rate ......i think that pretty accurate!!!

exspecially since the pgp palmer i have is the size of a side arm!!!!


anyway....when you are comparing new markers to old ones it like comparing apples and oranges!!!


i sure hope newer markers shoot better.....if they didnt .....why spend the extra loot for one????


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